DCI-Forum

Chapters => D-Cinema & Hi-End Cinema in the Home. => Topic started by: w.mayer on Thu January 04, 2018, 02:32:23 PM

Title: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Thu January 04, 2018, 02:32:23 PM
Take a look at this new NEC Pr. that had a dynamic Iris to boost cr. to 30.000:1.

First time I see a professional 4K DLP  that had this kind of dynamic iris likely very similar to
Home Cinema Pr.
Also nice all inputs are there even HDMI 2.0 with HDR is working.

http://www.necdisplay.com/p/np-ph2601ql
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Thu January 04, 2018, 04:09:13 PM
LCD projector?

The newly developed sealed optical engine creates a filter/maintenance free projector.

Epson OEM?

4K Ready - Display stunning 4K content using NEC's proprietary high performance video processing/scaling chip without the loss of critical details. 4K60P processing supported on all digital inputs from HDR10, BT.2020 signals using “Ultra HD Blu-ray” and “4K TV broadcasting”.

So, no Epson pixel shifting? But loop thourgh for 4-way blend?

4K Ready - Display stunning 4K content using NEC's proprietary high performance video processing/scaling chip without the loss of critical details. 4K60P processing supported on all digital inputs from HDR10, BT.2020 signals using “Ultra HD Blu-ray” and “4K TV broadcasting”.
TileMatrix enables 4Kx2K resolution utilizing 4 projectors via HDBaseT Loop Out

And 6500-lumen brightness enhances images for most applications

So something is messed up here: http://www.necdisplay.com/p/np-ph2601ql, as the picture clearly shows an DLP projector.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Thu January 04, 2018, 05:31:54 PM
Note it is at least another year out. 130K$ and 150K$

Release linked in another topic:

NEC Display Announces Release of RB Laser Projectors Offering High Brightness and 4K Native Resolution
Two new large-venue projectors provide digital cinema quality images, creating the ultimate presentation experience
NEC Display Solutions of America, Inc., a leading provider of commercial projectors and LCD displays, today announced the release of two new projector models, the 30,000 Center (26,000 ANSI) lumen PH2601QL and the 40,000 Center (35,000 ANSI) lumen PH3501QL.

“These new high-brightness projectors have a native 4K resolution for unsurpassed image details for graphics design, CAD drawings and Digital Cinema Quality Video. Coupled with 50-percent vertical lens shift and multiple lens choices, they provide maximum installation flexibility for most any environment” says Richard McPherson, Senior Product Manager at NEC Display Solutions. “We’re excited about these projectors because they feature the latest RB laser light source, which provides bright images and high resolution and makes them a perfect fit for customers who want maximum detail and color reproduction.”

Both projectors are well-suited for auditoriums, theaters, lecture halls, museums, sanctuaries and other large venues. Super dust protection for artifact free images and no loss of brightness over time. Built-in edge blending, stacking and geometric correction help support projection mapping when single or multiple projectors are required. These two models also offer the ability to provide image integrity, incorporating stable brightness (constant brightness) over a longer time period to alleviate image decay. The extreme brightness and resolution also offer a seamless alternative to video walls.

Additional benefits of the PH2601QL and PH3501QL include:
Viewable in high ambient lighting conditions
4096 x 2160 native 4K resolution
True 4:4:4 4K signal support

Complete panel for digital inputs, including HDMI (V2.0), DisplayPort w/ HDCP (V.1.4), HDBaseT w/ HDCP (V1.4/2.2), Quad 3G-SKI and an OPS slot
Screen size from 50 to 500 inches (1.27 to 12.7 meters)

Both new projectors will be available in January 2019. The PH2601QL will have a minimum advertised price of $129,999, and the PH3501QL will have a minimum advertised price of $149,999. They come with NEC’s 5-year/20,000-hour parts and labor warranty. For additional information and specs, please visit NEC Display Solutions.

About NEC Display Solutions of America, Inc.
NEC Display Solutions of America, Inc., a leading designer and provider of innovative displays, offers the widest range of products on the market, such as commercial- and professional-grade large-screen LCD displays, desktop LCD monitors, direct view LED displays, a diverse line of multimedia and digital cinema projectors, and integrated display solutions. Benefitting from the technologies of NEC Corporation and its own Research and Development, NEC produces leading-edge visual technology and customer-focused solutions for a wide variety of markets, including education, retail, transportation, broadcast, enterprise, healthcare, houses of worship, and many more. NEC is orchestrating a brighter world with the quality and reliability of its products and outstanding customer service. For additional information about NEC Display Solutions of America products, call (866) NEC-MORE, or visit the website at www.necdisplay.com. Follow us on our social media channels: Facebook, YouTube, Google+, Twitter and LinkedIn.

About NEC Corporation
NEC Corporation is a leader in the integration of IT and network technologies that benefit businesses and people around the world. By providing a combination of products and solutions that cross utilize the company's experience and global resources, NEC's advanced technologies meet the complex and ever-changing needs of its customers. NEC brings more than 100 years of expertise in technological innovation to empower people, businesses and society. For more information, visit NEC at www.nec.com. The NEC Group globally provides "Solutions for Society" that promote the safety, security, efficiency and equality of society. Under the company's corporate message of "Orchestrating a brighter world," NEC aims to help solve a wide range of challenging issues and to create new social value for the changing world of tomorrow.

For more information, please visit http://www.nec.com/en/global/about/solutionsforsociety/message.html.
NEC is a registered trademark of NEC Corporation. All Rights Reserved. Other product or service marks mentioned herein are the trademarks of their respective owners. ©2018 NEC Corporation.

NEC Digital Cinema Contacts:
North America and South America   
NEC Display Solutions of America
www.necdisplay.com
Phone: 630-467-3000

Sales: Jim Reisteter
General Manager, Digital Cinema Division
Phone: 818-557-2500
jreisteter@necdisplay.com

Marketing: Danielle Moore
Channel Marketing Manager
Phone: 630-467-3309
dmoore@necdisplay.com

Public Relations: Shelby Eversole
Digital Marketing Specialist
Phone: 630-467-4367
seversole@necdisplay.com

Europe, Middle East, Africa
NEC Display Solutions Europe Gmbh
http://www.nec-display-solutions.com/p/hq/en/home.xhtml
Phone: 49(0)89-99 6990

Public Relations: Ann Kjellser
PR Manager EMEA
Phone: 46 72 162 8719

Sales: Mark Kendall
Senior Manager, Digital Cinema
Phone: 44 118 969-1352

Marketing: Gerd Kaiser
Product line manager, Large Venue Projectors
Phone: 49(0)89 99 699-623

Japan
NEC Display Solutions, Ltd.
http://www.nec-display.com/jp/projector.html
Phone : 0120-610-161 (Customer Support Center)
      *9:00-18:00 except Saturday/Sunday/National holidays

China
NEC Solutions (China) Co., Ltd.
http://cn.nec.com/
Phone  +86-10-5934-2885

Australia, New Zealand
NEC Australia Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 3 9262 1111
http://au.nec.com/

Thailand, Malaysia, Philippines, Vietnam, Myanmar, Kambodia, Brunei
Goldenduck Group
Phone:  +66 2887 8807
http://www.goldenduckgroup.com/

Hong Kong, Macau, Taiwan
Strong Westrex, Inc.
Phone: +852 2827 8289
http://www.strong-world.com/

India, Sri Lanka, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal
Real Image Media Technologies Pvt. Ltd.
Phone: +91 44 42041505
http://www.realimage.com/

South Korea
Hyosung ITX Co., Ltd.
Phone: +82 2 2102 8591
http://www.hyosungitx.com/

*Web Site of NEC DLP Cinema Projectors
http://www.nec-display.com/ap/en_projector/dlpcinema/index.html
 
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Thu January 04, 2018, 07:41:26 PM
Its a DLP not a LCD see specification at the NEC Link I post down.

There they say "DMD 1.38 DLP" but I also read the "LCD" in the text above.
January 2019 is likely just a typing error as it make no sense at all to publish this 1 year before and put all
the technical specs at the web page.
Thing a typing error must be January 2018 I guess but lets see ......
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Thu January 04, 2018, 08:06:19 PM
In that case I hope it will be at ISE next month.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Thu January 04, 2018, 08:14:11 PM
Can confirm it was a typing error.
So right is 2018 release date!
So likely you will see it at ISE.
May I will visit ISE after some years not going as well as it looks there was many interesting things to see....
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: Peter CINERAMAX on Fri January 05, 2018, 04:45:06 PM
If this is similar to the RB that a group of us saw (Joe Kane was there too next to me ) at cinemacon, the color space looks not much better than blu laser and also short of rgb. 10k-1 is good though. Why can't they put irises on rgb lasers?

Maybe Christie will add dynamic iris to compete but with their rgb which is also compact.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Fri January 05, 2018, 07:09:16 PM
Well, as Coretronic showed in its brochure it actually meets Rec. 709, unlike many Blue laser-phosphor that require filtering to reach Rec. 709. Coretronic did show an Ultra Short Throw 4K XPR which it said was offering P3 gamut. It should also provide better yellows and reds. Peter you must not forget the reference is not Xenon, or RGB Laser, but blue laser or UHP lamps.

Christie was moving all its blue phosphor projectors over to BoldColor, but it left the (blue) laser phosphor cinema market it seems, selling xenon lamp and the (to come) RGB laser projectors.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: Art Sonneborn on Mon January 08, 2018, 02:30:41 PM

Yes ,please let us know what you think. 10,000:1 with that kind of light output !

Art
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: MrPixels on Fri January 12, 2018, 04:17:25 PM
I received confirmation this is not a d-cinema projector. Christie tried the DI route a few years back, Lon was first on the block to purchase one but it was riddled with issues related the DI. Maybe NEC will have better luck.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Fri January 12, 2018, 07:19:02 PM
It was indeed listed under the Installation Projectors category. Good to see that confirmed. NEC is particularly strong in the Laser Phosphor Cinema market, and it could design the secure path for DCi, but I see no reason for it to do so.

The model designation is also similar to the bigger 4K and 2K Laser-Phosphor DLP projectors NEC has been offering for the past 3? years, for installation and events.

The Christie was also an installation projector, making it smaller, lighter and less expensive by going to Mercury lamps, instead of Xenon bulbs.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Tue January 23, 2018, 04:57:16 PM
The 30.000:1 is likely coming only from Laser dimming.

I wonder as normally this kind of Phosphor Laser Pr. with a 3 chip design from NEC have native
only 2000:1 till to 2200:1 so a about 1/3 less than the Barco 6P Laser not cr. enhanced.
This means 15 times Laser dimming means you need to dim down the Laser to about 6,7%.
This sounds a bit much dimming for me so may there is in the light pipe an additional adaptive iris inside…. let’s see….
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Wed January 24, 2018, 03:28:32 PM
Today I got confirm that NEC will have a working unit at ISE in few weeks.
I likely visit the show one afternoon and will hopefully see it there under good condition.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Thu February 01, 2018, 05:08:06 PM
And Wolfgang will you attend the show? And have you scheduled a demo?

I see NEC has finally said it will show it and strat supplying in March/April: http://dci-forum.com/news/2/nec-re-announces-3040k-lumens-4k-rplusb-laser-phosphor-projectors/2586/.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Mon February 05, 2018, 08:42:43 AM
I have confirmation that the demo will be on the booth, there is no dedicated demospace at the show. NEC migt be able to arange demo's following ISE.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Tue February 06, 2018, 04:04:17 AM
I unfortunately must  cancel my visit at ISE show planed for tomorrow because of personal reasons.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Tue February 06, 2018, 03:57:15 PM
Not run at full brightness, don't know what brightness it was run at. Greyish content contrast looked good. One top shot of rainforest canopy, green to green contrast looked good. Reds were gravel colour, so hard to judge the claimed better than 'cinema, not as wide as rec. 2020', more than 100% P3, claim. But to my non-glden eyes they looked good.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: ebbles on Tue February 06, 2018, 06:38:56 PM
Sorry to hear about your personal issues Wolfgang, good luck and hopefully all goes well.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: ebbles on Tue February 06, 2018, 06:40:48 PM


Any further information on dynamic contrast, is it laser dimming? How did it look? Any signs of visual pumping?
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Tue February 06, 2018, 09:54:39 PM
Not at full brightness, no large contrast changes, no pumping. No dark room.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Wed February 07, 2018, 04:51:19 AM
Thanks ebbles for you nice words.

It is pity that after I cancel yesterday my flight to Amsterdam the news comes up that Samsung show first time there Cinema Screen LED there that supports as well 3D!
I still wonder from first time I hear about this Product that there was no talking about 3D as in Germany around 25% of the Cinema Turnover comes from 3D Movies.
Donald you can take a look how it looks?
Interesting also if they use shutter glasses or polarizer 3D glasses?
Both are technology wise possible.
Also interesting will be if there HOME LED WALL  can support 3D as well or not.

Sad that NEC not spend a separate light controlled room for such a Projector but this is typically for shows and one reason why I normally not going.

Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Wed February 07, 2018, 06:54:46 AM
It was not announced ahead of the show. If it wasn't for the 5.1 audio booming through to the open booth and some-one saying don't mind that's just the LED Cinema screen, I wouldn't have known. Managed to get into one of the demo's yesterday. Only ten seats so 30 minutes back to back is always filled with guests and potential clients.

4 clips first two SDR at 80 nits. Two SDR 3D clips at 300 nits, not graded for the higher brightness. Nut job was the cartoon, Unforgiven the 3D live action clip. I had a few times that the French German subtitles becam out of focus wheile the movie was fully focussed, that was my inability to adapt without notice.  There was one complaint about fast motion break up, I did not see that. I am always fiddling with those small 3D glasses, trying to schield them a bit.

Active 3D, as with most 3d LED displays. Given that this is the 2K version it would hurt spacial resolution. DCi certification is expected for May, so start saving;-).
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: w.mayer on Wed February 07, 2018, 07:20:01 AM
Just to made it clear you see and talk about the Cinema LED Samsung Screen right?

So how ghosting looks?
How color was in 3D?
Did you see flicker ?
What was the Source material 2k or also 4K 3D possible?
If 24P and did they show it at 2x 72 hz in tripleflash?

If you are still at ISE please ask Samsung to made 3D also possible for there Home Cinema Version of the LED Screen as at this price level not having 3D is for many include me a no-go.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Fri February 09, 2018, 05:22:00 AM
I asked about 3D, and not planned. With HDR it will have depth looking like 3D. So you can forget about that, unless you get the 2K LED Cinema Display. I went back a couple of times, but never saw the Cinema people again, so couldn't ask, and expect a correct and firm answer.

There were 4 clips, two SDR at 80 nits, two 3D at 300 nits to get 50 nits after the glasses.

Personally I did not see flickr. Some-one else sitting in on the demo saw some break-up in fast moving content. But I did not catch if that was 3D or 2D. I always struggle with those tiny distracting 3D glasses.

Color was color, material was not regraded.

Others stress they do not care about 3D, prefering a fully working and well performing uit over 3D, that has little apeal.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: Peter CINERAMAX on Fri February 09, 2018, 07:19:56 AM
I believe that once you buy a home screen it is possible that a cinema controller can be swapped for the SNOW controller that drives the Wall. The technology is not that different, its just bandwidth that has been extended to 120, The Wall will do 120 as it is designed electronically to handle next generation hdmi 2.1.


It is official SAMSUNG has selected my PH installation: SOLFAR as the first 2x wall installation for cedia 2018 75 meters from the Omni Hotel where the
PH is.

(http://dci-forum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2546.0;attach=3779;image)

In this Tweet i poletile raise the point of the lines being visible, you can see the top line in the pic.

https://twitter.com/CINERAMAX/status/931196996500754433

I COULD NOT BELIEVE AT CES HOW WITH similar display 3 months later huge swaths of wall had none of the lines, perfect alignment on 12 meter by 9 screen -zero imperfections, was it rear access adjustment that made it so perfect, i believe so, we need the wall to have rear access Z adjustment .

Regarding the columns that is why every single home theater in the world is 20 years retarded, BASS IS MULTIDIRECTIONAL, you get concussive bass from every discrete direction. Blue lasers, woven screens that redirect light to the side walls, Light like Bass has to be directional, what a bunch of fvcking morons the lot of you are for not using the realD ultimate screen and going with the v6.:D
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: donaldk on Fri February 09, 2018, 11:52:08 AM
Samsung's regular SMD LED walls also had some of the best alignment. Leyard for instance has a prototype 0.7mm Pitch wall that showed light coming through some of the cracks, when the image was dark or off.

I agree with Nigel that the 1.2mm ish pitch LED modular HD displays have to compete with the Sony ZD9 100" at less than two third the costs it has no seams, higher peak brightness, and sometimes better color, and generally less visible structure, being 4K.

The 0.84mm pitch (equivalent) The Wall, sits a class above that, being 4K, 146" diagonal.
Title: Re: NEC 4K Laser DLP with 30.000:1 Cr.
Post by: MrPixels on Fri February 09, 2018, 12:54:36 PM

This screen typically is not readily available to noncommercial theater owners. Looking for an internal contact, please PM, thx.